Yeah see that would keep me awake till 4!

Hi snackerlady
I have read a few other posts from people who have had cold-like and hangover-like symptoms. I felt nauseous and shaky on day 5 and finished work early on day 6 as I felt wiped out. I don’t think its surprising; we have severely restricted our cal intake and are forcing our bodies to fuel themselves in a totally different way. But I am on day 8 now and feeling much better. So hopefully it will pass for you too.

That’s excellent news Mike, well done. A diet is ok for a couple of weeks but keeping it going for six weeks takes real stamina. Good job.

It seems that quite a few of the recipes have calorie counts that aren’t quite right. I use the nhs calorie counter website to check all my ingredients just in case, and it doesn’t take me long at all. Usually, I have found the book overestimates the calories, for instance the trout with lime and mushy peas was much less when I worked it out.

Hi Guys, I havent calculated any. I have been using the book along side some of my own. Cooked since Monday when i started. Lost 5lbs. I will say i exercise each day for over an hour ( we have 2 dogs) - running, cycling. walking and climbing which is really good for the whole body. I have been dieting since September when i was diagnosed, so have lost weight prior to buying the book and signing up for this lifestyle. You cant help noticing the portion size has reduced dramatically too. I have stopped drinking alcohol and reduced decaf coffee and tea intake. I will use the books recipes as much as i can unless i find post here that say theirs is more accurate. Cheers guys . Best of luck. MARK

Hi Salky. Not in Cumbria, but near Durham, also in the far north and not a million miles away 😃 I’m now in week 9 of the 8 week plan (after consulting the team). I’m aiming to stay on the 800 cals for another few weeks until I go on holiday, then change to 5:2 or 2:5. At the end of the 8 weeks I’d lost 27 pounds, reduced fasting BG from 10.9 to 5.3, BP down, and lost almost two dress sizes. This week I have lost another 3 pounds so far. 😃

Paul – don’t see the nurse for another two weeks, but we had discussed coming off the meds. When I realised how I was feeling (remembering questions she’d asked) I took none yesterday, and only half of each tablet today. Feeling much better now, so will continue on half of each tablet daily until I see her. I didn’t want to just stop without checking BP with her. Hopefully when I see her it will still be ok and I can come off the meds 😃

Hi Penny,
Thanks for your support! Well, I’m in between anger and crying! Firstly (after an hour wait) I had my tests then saw the doctor, i said i’ve started a healthy eating plan and explained it and that I wanted to come off medication in the future starting with the Glicazide. I was told that my blood sugars are too high to do this safely – so i asked when would it be safe ‘when you’re having hypos’ was the answer. you can imagine my disgust. my Hba1C was 68 and that i need to get down to 48. When i then said ok , so I will aim to loose a stone or more then she said ‘you don’t need to loose any more weigh, your bmi is fine (it’s 25.6) – (errrrrr – If i weigh less then surely my body don’t have to fight to get the insulin around?).

She then went on to (try ) to explain how insulin works at which point i had to stop before i swore at her.

my question then was so if i follow this eating plan and do the exercise etc etc and i’m still high in BS – what else is there, her answer was more medication.

I requested a scan to measure my visceral fat to be told they don’t do this. – at this point she admitted I was motived and agree to test me again in 8 weeks and review my medication – and to have a look into my antibodies to see if there is something else going on because i’m only 38.

I understand that if my body isn’t producing enough insulin that I may need medication but I want to know that I have tried my hardest to reduce my BS’ myself and give my body a chance.

It’s made me even more determined! – i’mnow off for a dog walk!!

x

To everyone who replied to my item on the negative nurse. Thank you all so very much for your support, the comments have boosted my confidence enormously. I am amazed at the number of people with T2 diabetes who are finding the time to compare notes with each other. It can only be a good thing.
This book is going to turn out to be a life-saver for some folk, I have decided to follow its contents right to the bitter end. It will be interesting to see just how many of its readers cure themselves of this horrid disease.
Anybody else live in Cumbria in the far North of England as I do? We all have the same aims, maybe we could get together to form a little social club?

I made them to exact measurements and were way too runny. And they don’t taste good, not worth the calories in my opinion. Loving the sardine dip though!

thanks Bill…interested that you are feeling happier and less stressed….me too. I’m convinced it’s to do with the good fat, protein and no refined carbs but particularly the fat. When I was a kid in the 60s we ate average size portions of home cooked food, full fat everything, no snacks, mum would bake once a week and we would eat a couple of her cakes and occasionally we would have a small portion of sweets. None of us were fat. I’m back to eating like that albeit with fewer calories and bit of dark chocolate at weekends and like you no cake!
A crispy crime (sic…predictive text!) donut has 450 calories…..why would anyone bother!
Onward and upward!
Welcome Mrs Jaffa 💐……you’ll meet lots of positive people on here who have all been where you are….I’ve never joined a forum before but this one is very supportive, great ideas and everyone rooting for each other to succeed…….enjoy the journey!

Martin

To much hassle to go to the doctors every time I want it checking , also some ‘ white coat ‘ syndrome.

Yes if I take it 3 times in a row the readings were all different

Last time I took it twice a day [ same time every day ] and just used the average , it was maybe 10% higher than it should be.

Although this blanket less than 140/80 is a change , in the old days it was some figure + your age so as you got older the safe readings where allowed to rise , now the WHO wants every one on the planet to have the same readings irrespective of age,weight,fitness etc

I really need one of those 24 hour monitors that you wear , may ask if they are available to borrow at my surgery.

captainlynne

Thats impressive are you off the meds now ?

regards Paul

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/797688/experience-with-the-whoosh

Here people discuss the science and pseudo science about plateaux

Thank you pmshrink and penny for the link info.
Water is not the problem for me, I don’t retain salt (Addison’s disease). If i drink too much water, I faint.
Unfortunately, pain killers won’t solve the problem and will actually make injury recovery more dangerous than it is. I have to be constantly aware of how the back feels. I’ve just been given permission, after a year, to do 1 to 2 minutes of very specific exercises, for two minutes and then I need to wait a day to see how the back handled them! In addition, i have scleroderma and the bowels don’t seem to know how to work properly. If i added painkillers, i’d end up in the emergency room with an impacted bowel. bor-ing. Right now I’m dealing with mild autoimmune pancreatitis (caught in time), so all rules are off. Elevated prednisone to handle it. Simple carbs, no fats until the inflammation goes down. Sure do appreciate the support; it has been a very helpful part of this process. I don’t give up easily. It takes someone prying my hands off the go button to give up. It will only be if continuing is a detriment to my health as dieting has been in the past. i have a porphyria-like reaction to dieting. My doc figured out that i needed more steroids to handle the stress of the diet (since i don’t produce them) and he was right. A trade off, but it works! Just persistence and attention to details.
I’ll sure be glad to have a regular life soon!!!! I can’t wait to hike again.
Sunday I see the Dalai Lama, with whom I have had the privilege to study with for decades. Wheelchair and all, i’ll be there! A great pleasure soon to be had!
I appreciate all of your kind ideas and encouragement.

Thanks Janet – I like to have a coffee after dinner – we have one of those nespresso machines so that is my treat at the end of the day!

Hi Charlie
How did it go today?
Penny

Hi GofH
In order to find the thread ‘useful links’:
Scroll to the top of these posts, choose see ‘forums Fast 800’, chose ‘Fast800’, see the list of threads. Chose ‘useful links’
I must say, GofH, you stay so cheerful with all your health challenges. Now you’ve told us about your Indian friend, I can see how you do it. I will try it myself. I think also in the rich world we re surrounded by images of ‘life without the hardships, ‘ in the media, films, TV etc, as though it can always be like that. But it’s not and can’t be. I remember years ago being in North Africa and seeing people with serious disabilities amongst the crowds and being struck by how we hide that reality from ourselves, with people hidden away.
Keep on keeping on!
Penny

I totally agree Bill1954. I am not pre-diabetic myself but I am overweight so I need this diet to get me back on track so that I never have to worry about diabetes.

Hi TFTR
If you scroll up to the top of these posts you will find ‘forums Fast 800’. If you tap on Fast 800 you will get a list of the threads. Then choose ‘useful info’.
Re water. I think it’s really necessary to log it. I draw 5 glasses and 5 cups in my notebook and cross them off throughout the day. That’s 2.8 litres. I think you won’t achieve that without logging somehow.
Re ‘ permitted’ carbs ie brown rice and porridge I think Michael means very small amounts. But as you’re having a problem I would suggest not having them at all and see what happens.
Re exercise- that’s really difficult for you with that condition. Forgive me if this is naive- could you take painkillers just in order to exercise ?
Please don’t give up! With all our help and ideas you ll get there!
Penny

Thanks for the heads up Fi, I’ll look out for the programme too. I felt the same as you two or three days in and found it difficult to work. But it seems to be passing now. I also found that having a coffee in the afternoon helped pep me up a lot. I have to watch my caffeine intake but I think a couple a week in the early afternoon might give me the energy to push through. All the best.

Maybe if the recipe really does need to be that runny, you could put them into muffin cases.

Starting off great on Monday and then on Wednesday starting feeling nauseous but managed OK and then yesterday did not feel great at all and took to my bed! Stuck with the diet though because I am actually enjoying the meals and (so far!) no cravings. Feeling great today and my skin is glowing so back to being positive. Went out and bought a book called ‘The Real Meal Revolution’ this morning – it was a bit expensive but I had some book vouchers still left from Christmas but I am sure you can get it on Amazon for cheaper. Nice recipes following the same food plan so will try some out. I also went into M&S to get some venison sausages (I know processed foods are not allowed but the venison sausages are quite meaty and I thought as long as I count the calories it should be OK but they didn’t have any – what they did have however was something called High Fibre Super Sausages (they have borlotti and cannellini beans in them) – had them for my lunch (2 sausages = 252 kcal) with some ratatouille. Delicious! That’s it – haven’t weighed myself yet as I only like to way once a week so will have to wait until Monday morning. My husband was worried about Sunday lunch but I said it was OK I can still cook a nice dinner but it will only be himself having the roast potatoes! Oh, one more thing, my mum said that there is a new programme starting all next week on BBC1 (after the morning news programme) with Gloria Hunniford who has been diagnosed with pre-diabetes and it seems that they will be discussing our diet amongst other things so should be interesting – have already set the recorder as I will be at work!

Wise words, Auntylil. It’s interesting how your mind set changes following this ‘diet’. Captainlynne talks about taking her own food to social occasions. I have done this in the past, but felt really resentful about not being able to eat what everyone else is eating. Now I embrace the fact that I am eating healthily, and making a difference to my life, and almost feel sorry for everyone else! I am working on not seeing food as treats, but not quite there yet. I am still having one small square of dark chocolate after my evening meal, ‘as a treat’, and sometimes a small cup of cocoa made with almond milk and sweetened with xylitol. I know that if I can have these, life is still worth living. I shouldn’t need them, though, and it is as though I need to hang on to my sweet tooth. Oh how I would love to be rid of it completely!!

Yes, Bill, you and I are fortunate. But it is still hard work on our parts. Last night my blood sugars suddenly shot up indicating an inflamed pancreas. I needed to stay up quite late to constantly test to see how they were faring. Unfortunately they stayed up and I am now on elevated prednisone to handle the emergency (or i would end up in the hospital with full blown, life-threatening pancreatitis – been there, don’t want to do that a third time). The second time this has happened in the dieting process. Now it will be no fat, high simple carbs (still 800 calories) and i’ll likely be hungry as a goat. You can have the food in the frig, i’ll eat the door! It will not be an easy few days. And my blood pressure won’t stay up (Addison’s disease adrenal insufficiency)- so off to the endocrinologist for another medication to keep it up, lol. Assuming i can stand up without fainting. (An interesting by-product of the diet – i’m guessing my veins and arteries are getting cleaned out!) So salty miso soup, extra meds, etc and waiting before I try standing up.
So, folks, we all have our difficulties. But I tested Dr. Mosley’s theories and conclusions and the program works. Maybe for some, it is better to try it one or two days a week, to get an idea and then go for it. I’m re-reading the book and find more nuggets each time and see how they apply to my situation. Wishing you all well.

Janet1973 Yeah that’s old advice and still being used by some health professionals.
This diet is a new way of thinking and after seeing the results that are being posted here on a daily basis, who the hell can argue that this is wrong ?

Auntylil, I think we are singing from the same defiant, greedy, rewarding ourselves hymn sheet! Thank you for such an excellent post.

Well said Auntylil. From being taken to the shops for sweets after visits to the dentist (!) over 50 years ago, to the post-weigh in ‘treat’ after whichever slimming club meeting I had just attended, some foods were classed as ‘treats’.

Now my treats are experimenting with new foods, taking the time to explore supermarkets to find something that feels like a treat but is low-carb, and taking time for me (not always easy as I am in one of the caring professions). Even taking my own food to social occasions in case there is nothing I can eat available. Because I am so less irritable since ditching the carbs, any comments about what I’m eating don’t irritate me 😃

Well done Mike

Welcome Mrsjaffa13. 😃

Hi Paul

Sorry I don’t have the starting BP (only get it checked at GP. Been on meds for high BP for years (Bendroflumethiazide and Candersartan) which was keeping it under control.

After about a month on this BP was 117/87. Two weeks later it was 119/70, which the nurse said was low!

Sorry I can’t be more helpful.

Thanks guys, I’ll have a play about and see what works best. I train 2 days a week so on those days it might be better for me to have 2 meals rather than just 1. I suppose it’s all a case of trial & error 🙂

If I know where I’m going I check out the menu online, so can decide beforehand what I’ll eat. Think most of those do salads (ask for dressing on the side). Cafe Rouge may do poultry or meat with veg, not sure – a long time since I ate there! Not sure about Giraffe. A quick check online should help.

Welcome Mrsjaffa13! No one minds anything here – it’s very supportive and open. We look forward to joining your journey and have you help with ours 🙂

Welcome to the forums Mrsjaffa13
Stick with this diet, it will work for you.
If you need any help or advice just ask, there are loads of people at different stages of the journey that you are embarking on. Their experiences will give you a lift if you feel down as some do. Although none of us are experts, we are all going through the same thing and there is a real community spirit growing here.

Hi everyone, am a newbie just starting and have loved reading all your messages which are really motivating. Am needing to lose 2 stone most of which is round my middle and am higher risk of diabetes due to giving hubby a kidney! Put the weight on in last couple of years so need to reverse it and love the science behind this diet truly refreshing. hope you don’t mind me joining , you all sound very determined and in for the duration so hope I can be part of your journey and you of mine. 😀

I’m pretty sure you would absolutely need calories, even specifically carbs, on those days. Your body would need energy that is easy to access and burn, and I believe carbs are good for that – you won’t be storing them as fat if you’re being that active!

It makes me think of the fat vs sugar Horizon programme with the van Tulleken twins, where they cycle up a hill, and Chris (who was eating carbohydrates) fared much better.

Hi,

Anyone got any experience of endurance type exercise whilst on the BSD.

My hobby is Munro Bagging … as an example … a few weeks ago our walking club climbed Ben Ledi in the snow. A 6 hour walk with a climb of around 800m. My fitbit said that I used 4500 calories that day (probably an understatement as I was carrying rucksack / crampons / ice axe / flask of tea etc). This was typical for winter but we’ll soon be ramping up for longer walks as the days get longer. Usually 8 to 12 hours in the summer.

Just started the BSD today and I’m worried about the 800 calorie intake when I hit the mountains. Anyone got any experience or advice? Will my body cope or should I take extra calories on these days? I don’t think the mountain rescue guys will be too impressed if they have to carry me off the mountains.

BTW … joining a hill walking is a great way to exercise.

Thanks,
Martin

I never eat breakfast so stick to 2 meals a day and it has done me no harm at all.
The only small problem I can evisage is, as your sugar levels go down, you may be at risk of a hypo at times.

Hi there. Since day 1 (6 weeks ago), I’ve split my meals into two – a breakfast of fresh fruit, oats and nuts/seeds (about 230 calories), then have an orange early afternoon, followed by the remainder of my calories between 6-7pm. I found that this is a good way to split the calories, at least for me anyway.

Hi Paul,

I’m not a medical practitioner but a few comments …

1. BP measurements are notoriously fickle … even talking whilst you’re having your BP taken can give a false reading. Suspect that your resting BP is correct … ie … not the readings after exercise. Best to have it checked regularly at your GP and try to correlate their readings with yours.

2. Those readings look really high to me.

3. I read somewhere that an irregular heartbeat can cause big fluctuations in BP. Might be worthwhile asking your GP about this.

4. Biggest impacts on BP are salt intake and body mass. So pretty sure that this diet will help.

Hope that this helps.

Regards
Martin

Hi All, apologies if this has already been covered but, do you have to split the 800 cals between meals or can you just have 1 large meal? I’ve been following the original 5:2 and usually have all my calories at tea time, was wondering if I could/should do the same here. x

Well said auntylil, this thing about walking naked in the middle of winter, I’m reliably informed that the Finns make a habit of this and then they hit each other with sticks !!!
Each to their own, I don’t think I’ll be volunteering to buddy up on that. 😀

TO ANY ONE WHO HAS 5 MINS TO SPARE…

A few words about where I’m coming from… and I probably need to be open minded more but this is where I’ve arrived so far.

People can make changes – that’s not changing personality but habits because habitual behaviour makes us feel safe (like rituals) but we get stuck there even when we accept it is not doing us good, no matter how logical/rational the reasons. So that’s number one, everyone can make changes and we are doing that here in respect of carbs, calories and sugar. Lots of people are talking about this here and how they are learning not to berate themselves if they have some relapses.

Number 2, the psychologists/psychiatrists/counsellors/therapists/doctors are just the same as us, and Dr Mosley is generous enough to share his personal story with us. Most of them want to help and we fight them often don’t we? Plus they make us dependent on chemicals because they haven’t known about sugar etc. I know some doctors are unhelpful, ignorant etc but mainly they want to heal. We can educate them too.

3. We have our own ‘scripts’ but again we can change our behaviour. By believing then accepting that if you don’t make changes (ie. sugar is a poison, cigarettes, booze, going for a walk naked in the middle of winter!) ask yourself why are you hanging on to that behaviour. You will have reasons and you might need help changing it if it’s ingrained. Will power alone may not do it. Fear of letting go of habitual behaviour can feel very scary, so we may get defensive, stubborn, angry etc. If it feels like walking off a cliff seek help for goodness sake for the emotional stuff as it’s very powerful.

Another thing I know for sure is that being kind and gentle to oneself when feeling vulnerable and fragile, and that extends to others, is brilliant and that’s where success lies. Once I was fat, fair and forty and had to have my gall bladder removed, why I wonder did I continue for the next couple of decades to gorge on sugary stuff? My script was to be defiant, greedy, reward myself, become a foul mouthed old banshee if challenged. I’m still a bit of one of those but I am changing my behaviour and I feel pretty good about it. Hope you will.

This reply may be too late for you, but… you can always ask restaurants to prepare you something simple or to omit something off a meal. You can get them to grill you a piece of fish and steam some veg. If they are a proper restaurant they will do this. Even if you can’t get a piece of fish you could have some steak or something.

Doesn’t mean you can’t still enjoy it!

I’ve not tried any of the recipes as I always tend to do my own thing. (Two of my meals per day need to be easily constructed the night before, thrown into Tupperware, then eaten cold at work.) That said, were I to follow any, I would calculate my own calories as I went – and check everything.

Bill1954
I follow your logic right up until where we realise that the things we refer to as ‘carbs’ – pasta, potatoes, bread, etc – are actually just sugars and these are the things diabetics are told to eat.

The reason for the high amount of eggs is that coconut flour absorbs loads of moisture and has no raising agents.
The eggs help the products to rise as well as stopping them being crumble

I’ve decided to cut out one of the Exanatide injections starting Monday and then take it from there.
Hopefully the Metformin will follow and soon I can be drug free.

Aliba that’s fantastic !!!
You hit the nail right on the head when you said it’s a way of life now, hand on heart I’ve never felt hungry or craved for anything sweet since I started this diet (apart from my grandsons birthday, there was this cake you see, but my wife talked me out of having any by telling me how proud she was of me for sticking with this), and I just don’t see any way I would want to go back to eating the way I did before.
It’s not just the lowered sugar or weight loss either, it’s the complete package, I’m sleeping better, feel far less stressed, and generally happier than at any time I can remember.
Someone tried to wind me up yesterday by leaving a box of crispy creme doughnuts on my desk.
I just took them back, smiled sweetly, and said just the one word…. Pathetic 🙂

Thanks Celsa, I’m going to give it a go starting on Monday (cos that’s the law isn’t it?). Not sure I’ll do a full 8 weeks, but coincidentally I go on hols in 8 weeks…think I’ll do the 800cal thing until my weight’s down where it should be & then adjust. My other half is Spanish so you’d think the M diet would be easy but he’s a total carb fiend! If it’s white, sweet or stodgy he loves it (probably explains why he’s with me!)