Well, that was a disaster. …. not really hungry for dinner so decided (as I had loads of carbs left over from my budget) that I would have a Tuna sandwich and a cup of coffee. … even though it was carb reduced bread, my sugars went from 5.9 pre-dinner up to 9.3 after 2 hours. Guess I won’t be doing that again. …. Advice please. ..do you think this is because I’m still in the early stage of the diet (just Day 4, week 1) or will I never be able to indulge in a sandwich ever again. The bread was rated 23g for 2 slices of bread and the Tuna 2g per serve.

Wow those 23g of carbs are almost half of what most of us try to stick to per day!
That was an apt demonstration of what they can do to your sugar levels if you aren’t careful.
once you get your weight and blood sugar down, it’s reasonable to expect to re introduce some carbs slowly back into your diet but at day 4, it’s really too much too soon.

Thanks Bill1954, I’ve given myself a 50g carb budget and had only used 20g for the day, so I guess I thought I had 30g to play with. .. obviously not…. when you put it in % of allowance for the day, it is plain to see that it was a rooky mistake Oh well, lesson learnt and no more carb overload for me. …. other than this mistake, I’m finding the diet spot on. .. having lost about 3lb already. Really appreciating the forums. ☺

Ah bread, my nemesis! I’ve found that a home made bread with 3:1 ratio of spelt to rye doesn’t spike me – I had a slice with my salad two hours ago and my BG is 5.2 now. Bought breads, including things like crumpets, spike me like crazy (or at least they have in the past).

We’re all different though – it’s a matter of experimenting. My mum also eats my home made bread now, as it doesn’t spike her either. I always make her a loaf when I do mine and freeze it in packs of four slices so it can be easily separated. It’s very, very dense and my appetite has changed in two weeks of the BSD, so I was completely satisfied with 1 slice today.

I always use a breadmaker and haven’t tried doing this by hand in the oven… would be glad to hear if anyone tries it and has success though.

3 cups spelt
1 cup rye
1 teaspoon salt
1 tablespoon yeast
2 Cups water (sometimes less, but rye is very absorbent… at first you think you’ve added too much water but it soon gets taken up)

I add golden linseed, sesame seed, caraway seed or poppy seeds in various combinations and you can also add walnuts, pecans, or pumpkin seeds if you like. I normally put up to two tablespoons of seeds in.

Put all ingredients in the breadmaker pan and use the mixing cycle. Then put the timer on 1 hour 40 mins (40 mins proving, 1 hour bake)

This is quite a sensitive recipe to water, so you can get a little overproving if it’s too wet. Just go ahead and experiment, it doesn’t taste any different if you don’t get a nice domed top!

I think there is a misconception here re carbs.
The foods we are avoiding contain simple carbs that are digested quickly leaving you with feelings of hunger and which convert to fat all too easily
The carbs in leafy veggies etc are complex carbs which are burned at a slower rate and don’t really get a chance to be turned into fat. Distinguishing between the two types is important.

Sorry… I was being a bit enthusiastic and thought if someone is going to use bread of any kind I’d suggest the one that I use which really doesn’t spike me at all.

I realise bread is a big no-no to most people but I am happy to include a thin slice of my home made bread sometimes. I’m not sticking to as low a carb count as most people are, but trying to gradually improve it.

It’s too late for me to edit and remove my post now… apologies again.

No problem, I wasn’t arguing your post, just explaining the difference in carbs to the OP
Oh how I wish there was a bread substitute that actually tastes like bread 🙁

Thanks jpscloud for the recipe, I’ll file it away for later when I’m reintroducing bread into my diet. ..if I ever do, lol. ….. Bill1954, thanks for the redirection on carbs. .. I read, understood the difference, then totally forgot it …doh!

Thanks Bill. It’s quite a minefield really because to be safe I’d agree that in general “we” (BSD’ers) should avoid carbs like the plague in the Fast 800 phase.

I am being absolutely honest about the bread I make not causing a blood sugar spike in either me or my mum, and the slice I had with my salad today hasn’t made me hungry. Just being a bit too eager to share, I guess!

Hey jpscloud, please don’t apologise for sharing. …I think that’s what the forum is all about. … I’m so glad that you have found a bread that works for you (maybe in the future it will for me too. ..just not yet, I think😉). Like you said in another post we are all learning ….from each other …. from our mistakes. … from experiences. All good.

Thanks DJD… and best of luck to us all 🙂

jpscloud, you may have found the golden recipe, don’t knock it until someone says that they tried it and it spiked them.
In fact, if I can work out what spelt is, I just may have a go myself.

*Edit*
Amount Per 100 grams
Total Carbohydrate 70 g
Dietary fiber 11 g
Sugar 7 g

Jps if it doesn’t spike your blood sugars it might be the same for others. If I wasn’t so gluten intolerant I’d try it myself 🙂

70g carbs sounds very alarming, but that’s for the flour, I think? According to my google “research” spelt bread is around 15-20g carbs per slice, depending on which flour you use. It’s also one of the lowest GI breads and because it’s mixed with a fair bit of rye, that reduces the GI even further.

Still not a good choice for super-low carbing though – I am maybe just hanging on to old bad habits trying to include it in the fast 800! I probably should do without it and re-introduce it later on 5-2 or Med diet.

Maybe not, I did some more googling and it turns out that the carbs are the complex type so maybe not so bad as they sound.

I am very interested in this bread recipe , I have been googling a lot today trying to find a low carb bread recipe! I am going to be changing from the 800 cals to 50g carbs a day soon – can anyone work out approx how many carbs a slice this would be?

Hi DJDAussie,
Just making an assumption from your name, but if you are Australia based, check out the Herman Brot bread at 2.3g carb per slice. Their website will list suppliers near you.

Hi,
Spelt it related to wheat, both are in the family Triticum, but different species. It is over 9000 years old and went out of favour when we started going for very white breads. It is a smaller grain than the modern wheat and does not have the bran and germ removed, so keeps more goodness and has a higher protein content! It contains lower gluten and some people with a mild gluten intolerance may be able to eat it.
I classify it along with rye and barley. Full of good things, off limit on the 800 – but one to bring in on the 5:2. Like rye and barley it will release the carbs in a slower manner than modern wheat.
I thought I had some spelt in the cupboard, but looks like it went out last year when the mice invaded….. I did find some spelt and rye flour which might help Bill in understanding it.
It is 65% wholemeal spelt and 35% light rye flour mixed.
Per 100g – 340 cals. Fat – 2.5g; Protein 10.9g; Fibre 11.7g and the important one – Carbs 62.5g of which 2.1g are sugars.

This website explains a bot about it – ignore the ads. It was a better description than Wikipedia.
http://thespeltbakers.ca/what-is-spelt/

Correction to the above. Just finished watching Gardeners World and decided to look a bit further. I remembered I had seen that Sainsbury’s, Waitrose and Tesco all give full food breakdowns on their online delivery sites, so I did some checking. Spelt is in the same range as nearly all flours – 60g carbs (+/_ 5g) per 100g. Not a big difference in calories, it is higher in protein, but so is Canadian Strong White flour – the best bread flour.
The ones that were very low were coconut and almond flours,
almonds – 4g carbs per 100g flour, 40g protein, 11g fat, 20g fibre. Cals 315 – a little lower cals, but very low carb and high protein.
coconut – 9g carbs per 100g flour, 19 g protein, 12g fat, 50g fibre. Cals 320.
The one I spotted that I have not seen mentioned before was peanut flour. It specifically mentioned it is high protein, low GL – which should be good for this diet. It is also gluten free – so biscuits, scones, soda breads, but probably not yeast breads. Higher calories – 410 cals per 100g, Carbs 20g, 50g protein, 12g fats; 11g fibre.
I used to love peanut butter biscuits – do they still exist – my memory of them is from the 70’s, and I have not seen them since!
I will look this flour out next time I am in Sainsburys – it may be useful for the 5:2 phase.
The other surprise was barley. I have barley flour and you can make a barley bread – more of a soda bread, it does not make good bread. I got it when MM was talking about barley and oats being good for your heart. Did not get round to using it as I started on this. Anyhow, anyone who like barley grains – 81 cals per 100g barley; 1.5 fats, 12.5 carbs: 2.7 protein; 3.1 fibre. Will be looking out that mushroom barley risotto recipe this weekend!

Thanks for that info Orchid.
I’m not sure about the barley facts though. I always cook barley and brown rice together because of barley’s higher protein content. I had thought of having barley on it’s own even though it is higher calorie than rice. When I checked with Wikipedia it had barley at 73g carb per 100g, other sites were similar,so thought it best to avoid on the fast 800. I guess I could try a small amount now and see what effect it has on my blood sugar.

Hi Orchid, Could you point me in the direction of the mushroom barley risotto recipe please. It sounds delicious!

Hi cate, beford I became gluten intolerant I used to make Kasha – a russian recipe

8oz pearl barley
4oz mushrooms
1-2oz butter
2tbspns grated cheesd
1 egg
S and P

Beat ip the egg and stir well into the barley coat and leave to dry.
Slice mushrooms and simmer in 1pt salted water for 15 mins.
Remove mushrooms from pan and add the butter
Then add barley let simmer with lid on for 10 mins, stir occasionally
Pour barley mix into ovenproof casserole dish, with lid
Mix in the mushrooms and s and p.
Bake in moderate oven, gas mark 4, for 1 hour

When ready to serve you can stir in the cheese, and more butter if you would like to

You will have to work out the calories and carbs and decide how many portions you have.

I used to eat it with grilled sausage and tomato.

Lovely nutty flavour and totally delicious!

🙂

Cherrieanne I have just seen your response to barley.

The recipe i just posted could be split into at least 10 small portions ( some for the freezer) and eaten with something else. Meat eaters could have it with sausage and veg. I dont know what would work as a veggie meal.

Alarming amount of carbs, perhaps left til maintenance stage – and as a special treat. 🙂

Hi orchid, my russian kasha recipe comes out like a risotto 🙂

Hi Cherrianne,
I had looked it up on the Sainsbury’s site for their pearl barley as I did not have the info to hand at home. I have just checked and I did transcribe them correctly. I was surprised by it as well and had it not been late, I may have checked further. Tesco give a different set of numbers for theirs and Waitrose different again. Needless to say, Sainsbury’s are lowest!
I found a jar with Barley Grain in the house which is what I would normally use and the label in it is different again! Grrrrr.
Okay – lesson learned – don’t trust the websites.
I thought I had just spotted the reason for the difference, some were ‘cooked’, but on further checking – they all appear to be calories for the cooked weight not the dried weight.
For completeness – Tesco Pearl Barley – 100g cooked pearly barley 118 cals; Carbs 24.4g; Fat 0.4g; Protein 2.3g and fibre 3.8g. Waitrose cooked pearly barley 143 cals; Carbs 27.1; fat 0.9g; fibre 4.0g protein 4.6g.
I should be able to get into most of these stores this week and will check the labels on the product themselves and see if I can work out what is really going on!
It is still a good food for 5:2, but probably not for 800 cals unless as Hashimoto has, you have small portions with some thing else!
Thanks for spotting the error.

Sounds great – I will try in in May :-)!

I miss kasha and chicken soup with barley far more than bread 🙁

Hi Cate,
I used a Delia recipe which bakes in the oven and used barley instead of rice. http://www.deliaonline.com/recipes/cuisine/european/italian/oven-baked-wild-mushroom-risotto.html
You will need to keep an eye on it first time to make sure that the barley does not need more water or a slightly different cooking time. it should have a bite to it when it is ready. Lovely meal!

Hi Hashimoto, I agree.
I was brought up in Scotland and barley was commonly used especially in soups. I used to take packets of barley plus yellow and green split peas back to the Netherlands when I lived there after visiting my parents at Christmas! Pease pudding was another favourite.
Have you tried making barley bread? I was planning to when BSD diverted me – it apparently makes up like a soda bread or bannock. I found a link below. There are some other sites saying you can make it with a sourdough culture – not sure about that as it does not have gluten in it!

http://www.versagrain.com/barley-bread.html

I’m not frightened to use barley because from day 1 I’ve been knocking up pans of soup, stews, and broths to portion out for lunches and every one of them has contained barley.
When used like that a little goes a long way and barley has many health benefits.

Bill i adore barley and would still put it in soups but because I am so gluten intolerant I simply can’t eat it any more, sob, sob 🙁

Bizzylizzy, I guesstimate about 15-20g carbs per thin slice of my bread, based on what I can find on google.

Orchid I started using spelt and rye because of their lower GI values, but I know some people spike on them. My mum is 82 and won’t give up bread, so I set out to make a loaf that wouldn’t spike her and after much experimentation to find one that she liked, the recipe above was it! It doesn’t spike me either so I indulge in a bit now and then.

Edit: I should also add that my mum is underweight and has age-onset diabetes, still in early stages and managed by diet. She just won’t give up bread and as she’s underweight her dr recommended trying higher fibre bread. She doesn’t like flat rye bread.

Hi orchid because barley and rye contain gluten I can’t eat barley.

My mother used to use ham shanks to make glorious soups packed with veg, barley and other pulses, ooh I’m salivating now. 🙁

Hi Hashimoto, I need to do a bit more background reading as I was sure I had read that Barley was gluten-free! So sorry you can’t eat it any more 🙁 My mother made a very similar soup to that one! My other favourite she used to make was kidney soup – yes really. It was a ham stock, lots of root vegetables, cabbage and kidneys chopped into it with dough-balls (with thyme in them) on top! A meal in one. Not something she made often as it was a lot of prep and cooking, but absolutely lovely.
I can just see kids faces today if they got that put in front of them!

Sadly, orchid, barley, wheat and rye are the three main sources of gluten 🙁
Sounds like our mothers made similar soups! 🙂

Did you also get apple dumplings with golden syrup on top when there were plenty of windfalls? 🙂

Oh yes, my mum used to make lovely dumplings like this, golden syrup on one end, jam on the other & I was such a skinny kid!!

Yeh FiFip, I was so skinny my nickname was ‘rake’ as in skinny as a rake. Bet you ran about all day like me when you were a kid? Jumping becks, swinging on tarzies, climbing trees ( I even had a ‘reading’ tree in the woods), running up hills, building dens etc etc

Yep, raced around the woods, had a den, climbed trees, explored the stream, mum had a police whistle, used to use it when she needed to get us back inside for mealtimes!

Hi FiFip sounds like we had almost identical childhoods!! My mum couldn’t use a whistle though as dad worked a lot of night shifts. We were just told to be back at dinner time – and hoped our stomachs would tell us when that was! Unless we took jam sandwiches and water and stayed out over the hills all day! 🙂

My mum was from Sandy Gate, Marley Hill. We lived down South but she wanted us to have the same childhood as she had experienced, we ran wild, such a shame so many children don’t get to experience this type of childhood any more. Everyone is so risk-averse, fear obsessed.