The principle of this diet is everywhere. On TV, radio i the press. Watched a TV doctor explaining it to the presenter who, when looking at the array of allowed foods asked ‘where are the carbs’ . The doctor pointed him to the fruit, veg and nuts and the idiot said ‘what, no chips’. Still it was Eamon Holmes so what did I expect.

Although no mention of MM or the 800 calories it seems the Med diet is catching on.

If you log onto the phcuk.org and type in Healthy Eating Guidelines and Weight Loss Advice for the United Kingdom you will see that they are absolutely sold on the idea of low carb and low calorie diets for weight loss and improving health. On page 16 there is a picture of a plate division of good foods with half of it coming from simple carbs, so bread, potatoes etc. This was the old advice. Then turn to page 27 and the plate has changed to only include complex carbs explaining that broccoli, cauliflower, courgette, nuts and seeds are carb rich along with fruits like blueberries, raspberries and avocados.

One reason NICE in the UK are not accepting these findings is because they say, although it looks good, more research is needed. In reply to this phcuk carried out their own research and are re-presenting it to NICE. The other reason NICE are not asking medical people to follow this advice is, and I quote …..

“NICE have concerns that the current knowledge and experience of healthcare professionals may not be adequate to implement the LCHF diet throughout the NHS.”

So it is up to us to become the educators. Next time you go see your medical professional, print page 27 and show them what you eat.

Sorry, I just had to pop in to ask (rhetorically, that is) what the research was to justify the wholesale move to ‘low fat’ which was introduced, so far as I can see, without any cogent data to justify it and resulted in the (unexpected) result that manufacturers removed fat and added in sugar, thereby increasing everyone’s intake of that particular refined carbohydrate substantially, without their really realising it.

I do understand the requirement for research, especially for large-scale dietary advice, but evidently it didn’t matter so much then…..

I also understand the need for research but I can’t see what harm this eating plan can do. So maybe we should all keep doing what we’re doing until ‘they’ prove there’s something harmful!

Oh yes, Verano, I agree that we should all continue doing what we’re doing. And telling people about it. I’m convinced, just like you.

It’s NICE saying that they can’t change overarching advice until more research is completed. Epidemiology 101.
Which basic principle they took no notice of when the ‘low fat’ recommendation came out.

I hope I didn’t give the impression that I support the NICE stance on diet. I think they are pig headed and frightened to back what they seem to think is a great diet – our diet. They are afraid that they would be blamed if the diet did not work. There is also a cost implication in their statement about doctors and medical staff not being up to speed so not able to roll it out throughout the NHS. What they are saying is that medical people will need retraining and it would cost a lot. Why don’t they just buy every hospital and doctors surgery MMs book.

Igorasusual, Low fat diets came into vogue when an American president suffered a heart attack in the 1930’s or 40’s (don’t ask me who, can’t recall) and the American medical body decided it was because he was overweight and fat equals weight, so advocated low fat diets. The food industry couldn’t produce tasty food without the fat so added sugars. The rest is where we are now.

No, no, sunshine-girl, I think I’ve confused the issue without meaning to. Sorry folks.

I think that when you deal with nutritional advice to large populations, it is right to have good research to back up what you say and what you recommend. The Newcastle and other research is now coming to some very helpful conclusions about reducing refined carbs, and the benefits of low carbs to assist swift weight reduction, with consequent benefits on health in general and diabetic tendencies in particular. We are increasingly seeing this in terms of recommendations for Mediterranean diets.

I feel that it doesn’t help that doctors have extremely limited education on nutritional matters, and in addition have extremely limited time to spend with patients advising them. You only have to talk to friends and relations to get the ‘what, no bread!!!! what no potatoes!!! I could never do that…..” reaction. And of course, depending on what your diet has been, removing these refined carbs may make you feel a bit ill to start off with.

In addition, the cynical may point out (with some justification) that there may also be huge pressure from the food industry not to make changes to the ‘5 a day, low fat’ mantra we’ve all been living with. Let alone the ‘carbs with every meal’ Diabetic nurses’ lectures.

I simply jumped in to the discussion to add how frustrating it was that the advice about low-fat was not subjected to the same rigour.

In terms of buying everyone MMs book, we can all do our bit to demonstrate our own experience, and also quote what you yourself said in your reply to Theone on another thread (I’ve been repeating this to as many people as I can, thank you for writing it, by the way)

“a page printed from the Public Health Collaboration on Healthy Eating Guidelines and Weight Loss for the United Kingdom. The site is phcuk.org, an official government site for public health.
Conclusion on page 24 said in 2008 “Evidence from this systematic review demonstrates that low-carbohydrate/high-protein diets are more effective at 6 months and are as effective, if not more, as low-fat diets in reducing weight and cardiovascular
disease risk up to 1 year. More evidence and longer-term studies are needed to assessthe long-term cardiovascular benefits from the weight loss achieved using these diets.” That was in 2008
Finally, in February 2016 the fourth specific analysis was published in the British Journal of Nutrition finding that “Compared with subjects on low-fat diets, subjects on low-carbohydrate diets experienced significantly greater weight loss, greater triglycerides
reduction and greater increase in HDL-cholesterol after 6 months to 2 years of intervention.”
So between 2008 and 2016 the medical advice on nutrition has changed from thinking low carb might be a good idea to 2016 concluding it is a great idea. They go on to say that they are concerned that NICE are not taking up this advice and, in particular, still advocating high carb, low fat diets when it has been shown that low fat leads to fatter people. Apparently NICE are waiting for trial to end so phuk have carried out their own trials and their final final conclusion is:
In light of this scientific evidence the Public Health Collaboration recommends thatthe guidelines for weight loss in the UK should include an ad libitum low-carbohydrate-high-fat diet of real foods as an acceptable, effective and safe approach”

Onwards and upwards with the BSD.

Igorasusual, I see you have read the same report. Your question about why was the same stringency not placed on the advice to eat low fat. I think the answer is in the years, 1930 and 40’s research was so limited and governments listened to the so called experts without much to back it. Same as the evidence that low cal diets cause the body to shut down and stop losing weight taken from the 1946 study into men returning from concentration camps who were already so thin and their bodies had shut down. To prove that low calories led to quick fat return they fed them on high carb diets, so 2 birds with one stone. Conclusion low cal is bad, high carb is good. Then we have the low fat brigade coming in as I have already mentioned.

What you say about the food industry is also true. They have a big influence on what we eat and what we are told is good for us. Plus they have the government in their pockets.

sunshine-girl, YOU posted that report, hadn’t come across the organisation you mention before:

“the Public Health Collaboration on Healthy Eating Guidelines and Weight Loss for the United Kingdom. The site is phcuk.org, an official government site for public health”

Neither had OH, who is an inveterate google researcher of everything to do with diet, and was very pleased to be forwarded what you quoted.

you should read it, very interesting. It was too long to copy and paste but worth a look, especially the ‘plate’ advice then and now.

Will do. Thank you ! 🙂