Creating a plan and learning enough to carry it through

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  • posted by YBR
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    Hi,
    I’ve recently been diagnosed T2 Diabetic but have no symptoms, or none that can’t be explained.
    The diabetes nurse has not yet been much help – told me to lose weight (my BMI is OK, I’m not obese), to exercise (I may have a sedentary job but I am active), to smoke less (never smoked), drink less (I’m TT), get my blood pressure down (it’s fine) – you get the picture. I’ve basically not given anything more helpful than I can get from google.

    I’m going to have to take the initiative here, and I wanting to avoid medication I’m thinking about the BSD. I hope to discuss it with the nurse next week so want to discuss/confirm my ideas.

    I’m hoping to have surgery around the end of January so the plan would be to wait until after I’ve recovered (4 weeks).
    If I start immediately I’d be dieting over my birthday, so start mid-march, …
    but we’re booked to go on holiday (full-board) just before Easter, which would make it impossible that week.
    So I can see myself already building up excuses and pushing it back. What have people done in similar circumstances – would you start after your birthday and take a week “off” or not start until after the holiday? (I wouldn’t stuff myself but choose the best options I could.)

    Also I’ve never dieted, or calorie counted or anything before and I have no idea where to start. The recipes in the book are full of thinks I’ve never heard of and surely are relatively expensive – also there are so many fish recipes and I don’t eat fish or seafood. Any advice how to start figuring all this out? How to calorie count a portion of home-made dish?

  • posted by Verano
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    Hi
    For people with T2 this really is a Way of Life rather than a ‘diet’ which suggests restriction for a period of time. Carbohydrates are the secret of controlling blood sugars rather weight loss per se.
    Take a look at the diet doctor website which has some great graphics of low to high carb foods.
    Not all medics are sympathetic to this way of eating so I suggest you also read Prof.Roy Taylor’s book ‘Life without Diabetes’.
    It really is possible to reverse diabetes by restricting carbs, as many people on this forum have done.
    Enjoy the journey …. remember there’s no time like the present!

  • posted by RubyG
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    Welcome YBR, you’ll find lots of support on these boards.
    Have you read the original Blood Sugar Diet book? This gives a good insight into diabetes and that you don’t have to be obese to be diabetic.
    I would also abandon all excuses about when to start – start today 🙂 and deal with each day as best you can.
    Re. calorie counting – I used MyFitnessPal (a free app) – a bit of a pain to use but it works. I would also say that planning meals in advance works too, so you know what you are eating is the right stuff and the right quantity.
    You say the recipes are full of things you’ve never heard of, and you don’t eat fish or seafood – if you tell us some of the things you do eat I am sure others on here will chip in with suggestions.
    Also, weigh and record everything you put in a homemade meal, divide by the number of portions and enter it in MyFitnessPal – you’ll soon get the hang of it.
    Key things I would suggest to start with:
    – cut out ALL sugars – that includes sugar, honey, maple syrup, fruit juice, sweetened drinks. A square of very dark chocolate (>80%) is an occasional treat.
    – cut out ALL white starchy food – potatoes, rice, pasta, bread, other stuff made with flour, breakfast cereals, and all cakes, biscuits, etc.
    – focus on lean protein for the first 8-12 weeks, eggs and chicken breasts are your friend (especially if you don’t eat fish) and above-ground vegetables
    – homemade vegetable soups are a good lunchtime option as they are filling, can be made low carb and low cal
    – fruit – limit this in the first 8-12 weeks, a few berries are generally OK, bananas are off the menu sadly
    Good luck!

  • posted by sunshine-girl
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    Hi YBR, to add to the great advice you have been given. There are no signs or symptoms for diabetes except maybe thirst and drinking a lot and this leads to peeing a lot. A bit like high blood pressure, not easy to detect, which is why so many people dont realise they have it.

    First of all you are in the right place to knock this on the head completely, did doctor tell you your HbA1c number, it is important to know so you know what you are aiming to improve. Do buy Michael Mosleys book The 8 Week Blood Sugar Diet. Also buy Dr Clare Baileys BSD recipe book, also use dietdoctor.com for ideas of what to eat but also for recipes. You can sign up to the Fast500 emailing list and receive some lovely recipes from time to time. Also look on keto sites for recipes – they are low carb but tend to overdo the protien.

    The meals dont have to be complicated, full or strange things or things you dont really like. I hate all seafood and fish. Think about what you normally eat and just eat it without the carbs. I.e. (as has been said above) no potatoes, no pasta, no rice etc etc. If you want you can replace these by using vegetables but definitely not other root veg, so dont swap potatoes for swede, or pasta for brown pasta, they are still as high in carbs. As an example I make lasagne and instead of using pasta sheets I use ribbons of courgette or aubergine or even a layer of sliced tomatoes if courgette and aubergine are strange to you. Buy a small caulflower and put it in a whizzer or grate it to simulate rice then just heat it through in a frying pan with a touch of a good oil (rapeseed or olive) not a bog standard vegetable oil and deffo not corn oil. Try a nice hearty stew with lots of button mushrooms, onions and a few carrots, make a standard bolognaise or savory mince dish. If you cant be bothered to mess around with courgettes etc just give yourself a good portion of any of the recommended veg (green leafy, peas, leeks, look at dietdoctor for ideas).

    Drink plenty of water as limiting carbs releases fluid from the body, makes you pee a lot and can dehydrate you. If you feel weak or dizzy add a touch of salt to a meal. Eggs are a great standby, omeletee, scrambled, poached, boiled – but without the bready dips.

    Honestly we could give you so much advice but you will forget or not take it all in, which is why you should get the book.

    Do as others suggest and start the diet today or tomorrow. I know Christmas is coming soon and you might want to see that through first. Then clear out all the junk. read some recipes, have a good idea of what you are going to eat, buy what you will need so you dont get caught out and enjoy a new way of life. As for your birthday, it is in the name birthDAY not birthweek. Take this seriously, diabetes is very serious ones it takes hold. You want to avoid going onto medication at all costs or you will be on a slippery slope. I am on insulin and never got off it yet. Verano is a great example of someone who completely reversed her diabetes and a great role model.

    Just remembered, fat is your friend. NEVER EVER eat food that claims to be low fat, diet or even low sugar (unless it really is) as most of these products replace the fat with a carbohydrate to give it ‘mouth appeal’ and that is usually rice powder or potato powder. So buy full fat foods like yoghurts, cheese, milk or cream, real butter but eat sparingly – they satisfy you more because they fill you up and they taste great. The only thing I have against low sugar is that it can fool your body into thinking it is getting something sweet and create an insulin respose. When the insulin floods the blood and finds there is nothing to battle with it gets stored as either fat or in the liver. Gosh there is so much to know.

    Good luck and feel free to ask as many questions as you need to.

  • posted by YBR
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    Thank-you all for your encouragement.
    I’m thinking of starting next year because (1) I really do need time to get my head round this – until I have some time off I don’t have the mental space, (2) best to start when more likely to succeed, (3) I’m not ready to tell everyone yet (I can’t face certain relatives on my case – some people can be horrendous) and (4) because the book explicitly says not to do the BSD if you are recovering from surgery. I also need to get my DH on side who does all the shopping and cooking. I’m a person who plans and problem solves and evaluates before starting something new.

    “Think about what you normally eat and just eat it without the carbs.” Well breakfast or lunch without the carbs is absurd so I am re-thinking those. The more difficult thing that needs solving is that it’s not just me to feed. I have a fuss-itarian child (8yo) who eats very little but carbs, and a vegetarian child (10yo) and we’d land up cooking 3 or 4 dinners every day. So while courgette, aubergine, tomatoes, cauliflower, (broccoli, sprouts, peas, beans (green)), mushroom, onions, carrots are all fine for me, someone else won’t touch mushrooms, or cauliflower, or courgette or …
    So it’s going to take a little time to find the tips like vegetable lasagne sheets and cauliflower rice (wonderful, thanks). How long do they keep for; does it freeze OK?

    I’ve got Michael Mosleys book The 8 Week Blood Sugar Diet and am mainly working from that, also a couple of others from the library that I’m working through when I have time. I’ve added others to my wishlist – hopefully I’ll get some book tokens for Christmas!

    You make a good point about it being a way of life. I’m not expecting 800 calories a day to be forever – but if i can achieve that for 6-8 weeks, then it should be habit-forming enough to move to the next stage. I’m encouraged to get started early next year, even if I put it on pause for surgery/recovery.

  • posted by sunshine-girl
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    Whatever changes you make and whenever it is your road to travel. We are all here to cheer you on. Dont be shy and let us help you, but heck I sound I a …. cant think of the word, an evangalist, we are not like that.

  • posted by Verano
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    Hi.
    I’ve bumped a soup thread up to the top for you. Soups are a great lunch instead of carby alternatives and they freeze really well.
    I make ‘mash’ and freeze that in portions too. Cauliflower, cauliflower and broccoli , cauliflower, broccoli and celeriac etc etc etc. lots of combinations!
    Following on from sunshine-girl I copied a section from I think the original 5:2 diet book which I look at now and again…..
    “Any method must be rational, sustainable, flexible and feasible for the long haul …. It must fit into your life as it is, not the life of your dreams. It needs to go on holiday with you, it needs to visit friends, get you through a boring/challenging day …. and cope with Christmas.
    Your body is not my body. Mine is not yours. So it’s worth carving out your plan according to your needs, the shape of your day, your family, your commitments, your preferences.”
    Take your time but do try this way of eating it’s definitely far better than going down the medication route.

  • posted by RubyG
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    Good luck with the plan YBR, I do understand that you need time and headspace to figure out how you’re going to do this, but it’s so worth it.
    While you may not have symptoms of diabetes, it is not to be taken lightly.
    As others have said, try to manage this with your diet before the meds route, with the support of your doctor of course.
    There was also another thread on here recently about avoiding the label of diabetes and all the implications it has on future risk ratings for things like life insurance, travel insurance, driving licence, etc.
    You seem to have caught this early, so good luck in your endeavours.
    Simple rules we started with:
    Breakfast = egg-based
    Lunch = soup
    Supper = portion of lean protein and green veg, cauli is your friend and a great potato substitute
    Snacks = avoid if possible
    Water = drink loads
    Good luck, whenever you choose to start

  • posted by Jennie10
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    Hi YBR
    Just read this (always late to the party – although no party this year!) and thought I’d add my twopenn’orth. Sounds like you’ve got a great plan now, and no need to think about your holiday until it gets closer.
    Your diabetes nurse reminds me of mine when I was first diagnosed with Type II in 2016. That’s a while ago now and I think there’s more awareness about using diet e.g. the BSD and/or low carb diets as a way of putting Type II diabetes into remission these days but even if that is true nationally and in some areas, it isn’t the case everywhere (still not trickled down to health staff around here). So creating the plan and learning enough to carry it through is a great idea.
    As well as MM some other good, reliable sources of info include:
    Prof Roy Taylor – he’s one of the leading lights in relation to Diabetes in the UK (also helped the Hairy Bikers lose weight). As well as his book which Verano mentions if you google Roy Taylor Diabetes you’ll find some of his presentations which are worth watching.
    Dr David Unwin – a Southport GP who has been recognised in the NHS for his work treating his diabetic patients with diet – again you can just google him using videos – the Public Health Collaboration ones are good
    Dr Jason Fung – he’s a Canadian consultant who treats people with Type II diabetes. His book The Diabetes Code is good but he’s also got lots of videos which you can find via google. He is really good on explaining the old and new way of thinking about the causes and treatment of Type II diabetes.
    I’d push for 3 months doing diet-only and without medication if that’s what you want. (That’s the way I did it even though my initial hba1c was really high).
    After the first 2 weeks I gave up on the recipes in the book (for similar reasons as yours). Start as everyone says. You might at some point try eating 2 meals a day rather than 3 (2 larger rather than 3 smaller meals definitely suited me best).
    If you don’t use the recipe book, it is helpful to weigh and record your daily food if you can. (I use fatsecret.uk but lots use myfitnesspal like RubyG). Understanding your daily carb consumption in particular is useful. Then at your next hba1c if your bgls aren’t quite back into the normal range you can just reduce your daily carb intake a little bit for a few weeks and see if that does the trick. Verano mentioned dietdoctor. The pages which show how many carbs in vegetables, fruits etc are really helpful https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/vegetables (Dietdoctor are pushing membership atm but don’t be put off there is a lot of good free stuff too)
    This diet/way of life works! People do put their diabetes into remission so definitely worth doing. Also, depending on your hba1c on diagnosis (agree with s-g about knowing this) it may be that you don’t need to make too many changes for it to work for you.
    Finally, you don’t need to tell anyone yet – I just told my husband and children initially. Like you, I couldn’t face certain relatives – do you think we’re related!?! Being ‘on a low carb diet’ is a handy reason often used for the change in eating.

    Jennie xx

  • posted by YBR
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    Thanks Jennie and others.
    I tried MyFitnessPal and quickly decided I won’t get on with it, FatSecret may suit me batter, but I also just received a FitBit (Wedding anniversary present) and that seems to put more things in one place. I’m currently getting used to logging stuff, which while it will in itself change things, will give be a baseline. That will encourage me to weigh stuff, at least until I get a better feel (aka. calibrate my eyes).
    Having all your references to reliable information is invaluable – there’s so much rubbish out there and it’s hard to be certain when starting out.
    I don’t think we have to be related although it’s possible, there are enough individuals who have no empathy, and little sympathy, unfortunately. One in particular is over-engaged in other people’s lives, particularly now the pandemic has left her very few other things to do.

  • posted by Jennie10
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    Hi YBR
    I thought I’d post a couple of specific links for you to look at in your own time. I think Jason Fung is really good, but when I just put his name into YouTube I realised there are a lot of newer, shorter video clips and I’m not sure what they’re like.
    So here are a couple of older longer lectures of his.
    How to Reverse Type 2 Diabetes Naturally | Jason Fung – YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAwgdX5VxGc
    Two Big Lies about Type 2 Diabetes – YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcLoaVNQ3rc
    They both cover the same ground just to different audiences. Jason Fung treats his patients with fasting. I’m not saying for you to do that, but personally I find he’s good at explaining the rationale behind treating Type II diabetes using a dietary approach – and sometimes it’s nice just to watch something!
    In one of these (I think it’s Two Big Lies), he mentions (Roy) Taylor’s work. Roy Taylor’s research and his Newcastle Diet (used with people with Type II diabetes) very much informed Michael Mosley’s Blood Sugar Diet – Roy Taylor does the introduction bit in the BSD. So even though they all use slightly different approaches, I think they’re all coming from the same basic principles.

    Enjoy Christmas and see you next year.
    Jennie xx

  • posted by YBR
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    I’ve now a plan to start properly on Epiphany (6th Jan) which gives us all a bit of time to finish the Christmas Pud/Cake/Mince pies and normal activities to resume. Breakfast and Lunch are switched already, and I’m drinking squash instead of fruit juice because I’ll pour out a pint at a time and even watered down …

    I’m working on my husband, who does all the shopping and cooks dinners. Last time I asked for healthy full-fat Yoghurt and he’s bought low-fat sweetened (with sugar) for me and corner yoghurt with chocolate bits for the kids! He tells me that there’s nothing full-fat available. Are there any brands to look out for?
    We also talked about the bolognaise we have fairly frequently and he was shocked to discover the ingredients of vege OXO cubes – top ingredients: dried glucose , potato starch! Again, are there better alternatives anyone can suggest?

  • posted by Verano
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    YBR
    Glad you’ve made a plan.
    Yogurt …. best look for Greek Yogurt with either 5 or 10% fat. Some of the brands I’ve tried are….
    Total Fage 5%
    Tim’s Dairy, Lancashire Farm, Aldi and Lidl own brands, others are available ! Check for ‘Greek’ rather than ‘Greek Style’.
    I wouldn’t worry too much about the odd stick cube because most of them have less than 1g of carbs per 100ml made up and when you divide the carbs by the number of portions they become negligible.
    I’d check on the squash you’re using. Sweeteners tend to fool your body into thinking it’s getting ‘sugar’ so best to stay away from anything with sweeteners if you can.
    Best of luck!

  • posted by Jennie10
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    Hi YBR
    Hope you had a Happy Christmas and best wishes for the New Year. It’s great to see you back and starting your plan. I agree with everything Verano says so can’t really add anything to her post but just wanted to wish you good luck. Any other questions do keep asking on here or any of the other threads which you’re welcome to join at any time.
    Jennie xx

  • posted by freester
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    @ybr – just in answer to your yoghurt question. I made a similar mistake the Full Fat Greek and Natural yoghurt isn’t always situated right by all the sugary half fat ski and muller corner type things in the supermarket.

    It’s usually closer to the dairy / cheese where there will be bigger (500g or 1kg) tubs. All the usual supermarkets (ASDA, TESCO, LIDL, ALDI etc etc etc) will have there own brand Greek style yoghurt. Beware there will be reduced fat in similar tubs right by the full fat stuff.
    I’m a sucker for the Lidl premium and Asda Extra special Greek Yoghurt. It’s extra thick and creamy. Nom.

  • posted by freester
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    Oh and don’t panic about the stock cubes. I’ve always used the Knorr vegetable stock cubes as I prefer them. They also have starch added. Once watered down negligible compared to the food you’ve cooked it in.

  • posted by YBR
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    Started today and OK so far.
    I started a little futurelearn course on Diabetes: https://www.futurelearn.com/courses/reversing-diabetes-fact-or-fiction
    I managed to resist the tub of sweets & mince pies in the office at work, then came home ‘cos it’s too cold in the office (workmen have the fire-escape door open brrr…)
    Cauliflower rice I’ve found odd, in the sense of unfamiliar – but definitely edible!

  • posted by sunshine-girl
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    Hi YBR, I often do Futurelearn courses and have done several on diabetes but will take a look at this one in case it is something new. You might also take a look at one called Super Foods, Fact or Fiction or something like that, it was an eyeopening into the world of advertising and how we get fooled and what is the real truth about things such as goji berries, kale, etc.

  • posted by sunshine-girl
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    Just registered for the FutureLearn course YBR mentioned and it is new. I am going to post details on another thread if that is okay.

  • posted by YBR
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    Hi,
    today I’ve questions about Ketosis, which I see on here quite a bit.
    I’ve googled so I think I understand what it is, but how important is knowing whether I’ve achieved it?
    How is it measured If I need to know?

  • posted by JGwen
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    Hi YBR,
    Think of your body as having 2 types of fuel. Type one is you are burning carbs, type two is you are burning fat for fuel. Your body can only do one or the other, it can not do both at the same time.

    Because sugar is so damaging to your body, if your body is responding to having eaten a high carb meal by raising insulin then it will be burning the sugar, only once the carbs are burned up does your body revert to burning fat.

    Your body is clever, it does not want you to starve. So if calories are limited but insulin remains high preventing you from using your fat stores for fuel for a number of weeks / months then your body will respond by making your metabolism more efficient. So you need less calories for every day living. That makes it not only harder to discard extra weight, but easier to put on extra weight in the future. – (Look for articles online on the long term outcome of the USA program The Greatest Loser.)

    So how can you be sure you are burning fat ( in ketosis.)…

    Option one, fasting. The obvious option is if you don’t eat anything for a while your body will use up the sugar stores and move into ketosis. How long does it take to get into ketosis, it does depend on your sugar stores, but if you look at Dr Fungs work then 36 to 42 hours are the normal recommendations for getting into ketosis and having a period where your body is burning fat / healing.

    Option two, keto eating plans. – Research has shown if you eat less than 20g of carbs a day every day you will be in ketosis. So some people install an app like fat secret on their mobile and count daily carbs.

    Option three, work out what your personal boundary is for carbs and being in ketosis. – While those of us who have been on a high carb diet for years and are not athletes have to stick to under 20g of carbs a day, Elite athletes are more “metabolically flexible” and can switch back and forth between carbs and fat for fuel during a day even on 100g of carbs a day. – If you measure if you are ketosis you can work out your personal carb boundary which may be more flexible than 20g of carbs.

    Option four, eat low carb and count calories for only a short period of time. Maybe as this is DR M’s forum I should have put this as option 1. Its why he recommends only following his protocol for 8 weeks at a time.

    Having read back through the posts on this thread, it sounds to me like you may want to read up on Insulin and Insulin Resistance, which is the stepping stone where eventually the damage progresses to being diagnosed to T2. I would strongly recommend Dr Bikmans work as well. –

    ———-

    How to tell if you are in ketosis, well the first is what not to do. Don’t waste any money on pee sticks. – These are sticks that test for ketones in your urine. When you start going into ketosis your body will generate surplus ketones and get rid of them in your urine. – But this is only at the start, after a while it gets efficient and only generates as many ketones as you need for fuel.

    There are plenty of mentions on USA and Canada forums of using blood test monitors. These involve purchasing both the monitor and test strips. – The monitor that seems to be the most popular is not sold in Europe or the UK. so most people this side of the pond don’t test to do daily tests.

    The third option is testing your breath for the byproduct of burning ketones. There are specialist monitors sold, and cheap breathalysers available from Amazon sold for this. Turns out they use the same mechanism so you may as well buy the cheap option. – There is a knack to using them, involving holding your breath and then its the last of the lung output you need to blow into the monitor. There is a thread we used to use to save links to useful articles and research papers. Called Take a Look at This, If you search it for links I posted a couple of years ago that mention AT6000 (the make of cheap breathalyser used to test for ketones) you will find more info.

    ———————–

    Should you test ? When I started on this journey a few years ago, it was all about weight loss for me, and I had more surplus weight to discard than it would have taken me 8 weeks to achieve. So I had to work out what to do to continue beyond 8 weeks. I have found using the cheap breathalyser useful as it has highlighted to me how long it takes me to get into ketosis, and how few carbs it takes for me to fall out of ketosis even 2 years down the line. ———– It has also helped me confirm what feelings in terms of energy and mental awareness mean I am in ketosis, which then means I can tell without having to test. —————-

    However, I do think there is an element that measuring ketones has been for me about trying to fight the tide. I realise I have been trying to juggle emotional pulls to eat with trying to heal, stopping for meals during the day, and looking with envy at the “nice” food everyone else is buying is the supermarket is all about a twisted view on what is being kind to yourself.

    Hope that helps.

  • posted by YBR
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    Thanks JGwen.
    Looks like it’s a personal thing, so I’ll try without for now.

    I’ve so far managed to resist the remaining Christmas cake, and I’ve lost 3lbs already so I’m happy with that.

  • posted by YBR
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    Update:
    First eating and weight – I’ve given in to temptation a couple of times over the last week, but even without that the amount of carb oscillates a bit. I haven’t yet got a handle on how much carb lentils or chickpeas (for example) have in them. I have lost weight, so it’s working from that point of view.

    I’ve seen the nurse today and she was more helpful – acknowledged I’m not a typical diabetic because I’m not overweight etc and acknowledged that the “enpower” education sessions for diabetics, which she sent me on, are not as helpful as they’d like.
    I’ve now got a freebie glucose tester (will look at sourcing more test strips etc there’s a small supply with it). That gives me the option to monitor and figure out what is working and what is not. Plus a referral to the hospital’s new Diabetes support service, which I hope will give me help both in getting the fast800 on an even keel, and in transitioning to maintenance WoE. She’s had good experiences with another atypical slim diabetic, so I’m hopeful.

    I’ve nearly finished the futurelearn course: it’s very technical in places so some of it went over my head. Still interesting, particularly the parts about the support needed to make self-management as successful as possible. The course is done by my local university-hospital trust so this ought to correspond to the support service mentioned above.

  • posted by YBR
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    I’m beginning to notice the difference in how I feel, but I’m persistently significantly under 800 calories a day (except when I submit to temptation). I guess that’s not good to continue. Any advice please?
    I have yoghurt, berries and seeds for breakfast,
    salad (lettuce, cucumber, celery, sweet pepper) and cheese or ham for lunch.
    Dinner varies – today pork with tomato and onion sauce with some aubergine.
    Drink mainly water, with max one cup of tea a day.
    Carbs vary from 20g to 57g so I’ve still not quite got a handle on that either.

  • posted by RubyG
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    Maybe because I have the innate ability to eat like a pig, I struggle to grasp the concept of not being able to achieve 800cals per day. Unchecked, I could eat that over a day’s snacks of nuts and cheese, which is why I am back tracking every morsel and balancing every meal to come in at 800cals.
    But back to you – are you tracking your protein intake as well as carbs (I have just read the latest MM book)? Are you achieving >50g per day?
    Are you eating full-fat yoghurt?
    Depending on the answers to the above questions, my suggestions would be to increase the protein and/or fat in your diet to achieve the 800cals and keep the carbs below 50g – full-fat yoghurt, olive oil on your salad, etc.
    But keep going, that’s the important part.

  • posted by freester
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    WRT 800 calories. There was anecdotal evidence on a Facebook group that a lot less than 800 is counter productive. I can’t give you reasons why. I think also some of MM’s original plans were 600cals a day but he upped it to 800.

    When I was doing 800 cals daily I didn’t sweat the 800 too obsessively daily. I’d plan a weeks meals. Daily 800 +/- 100 kcals. As long as the average was 800 +/- 50 cals over the 7 days I was happy. And it worked for me.

  • posted by YBR
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    @freester I’m not obsessing about 800 calories, but being persistently below 700 needs correcting, I think. Learning on the “job” here!
    @rubyg That’s helpful – my protein intake is generally below 50g at the moment, although other advice suggests the carb target should be below 20g? I can’t find these written anywhere in the BSD book, I may be being blind!

    I use full-fat milk, although very little of it in tea at the moment, I have full-fat yoghurt when I can find it – practically non-existent in my local supermarkets.
    I’m told to get my cholesterol down (it’s fine for non-diabetics but still) so I’m getting conflicting advice about reducing fats, particularly having low-fat dairy. I would just have more cheese/ham at lunch to add the protein otherwise. Feels like a minefield.

  • posted by RubyG
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    I can only agree re. the minefield.
    The original BSD doesn’t set carb limits from what I can recall, but I think the new Fast Keto 800 book does aim for 800cals, <50g carbs and >50g protein (increasing this to 75-100g protein after the initial 8-12 weeks?).

    I also have a few cholesterol questions, which I’ll pose over on the weekly thread.

  • posted by YBR
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    Celebrate! I ate the chocolate.

    Of course there’s more to it than that.
    I was at a Selection day yesterday, and the Oh generous hospitality. No plain biscuits, various chocolate ones, boiled sweets, the works. It’s a stressful day, in and out of interviews and the candidate’s lounge was full of temptation.
    I know what I’m like, once I give in once, I’m gone. I set myself the target to hold out as long as I could and actually managed to stick to the food I’d brought.

    Having got home and received the phone call with a positive outcome, I celebrated with a single segment of Chocolate orange (from christmas). I’m utterly chuffed with myself. It may not ever happen again, but I’ll celebrate that small win.

    2 1/2 weeks in and I’ve lost 7lbs since I started.

  • posted by freester
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    Well done for resisting temptation, and the positive outcome.

    When I started I was 3 or 4 weeks in. Still sticking to the 800 cals and I had a monthly work meeting. The leader had a habit of bringing bags of rubbish, biscuits cakes all that stuff. I remember all my colleagues watching me probably thinking I would crack – which I didn’t.

    For me it’s a mindset thing. I try to enjoy what I choose to eat (not what I’m allowed, what I choose) and not miss the stuff I used to eat that’s off plan.

    As for chocolate, as your tastes change you’ll lose that craving for sweet stuff. For me during the 800 cal phase a little treat was (and still is) – a square of dark chocolate. So much nicer than that sweet milk stuff.

    You’re doing well.

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